It seems that the astrology gets more and more popular in China, my son is spending too much time on it, however, in our group of alumnus on Weixin(Wechat) lots of guys also talking or analyzing by using astrology, because we are classmates people know the date of birth each other.
I also tried to getting to people’s personalities and characters by signs of each individual, and seemed that it works…
Kay Benedict: may be astrology is a science; but nobody seem to know it fully…?. Is there a single astrologer, who is really is an “astrologer”, in the world who can predict/forecast calamities, wars, terror strikes etc to save hundreds of thousands of innocent lives….?
Jeffrey Tong: One must be careful to discern fact from fiction. I remember a political science professor once told me the greatest lies are based upon truth – the lie has some merit, but has been distorted to great lengths so the conclusion is far from reality.
For example, although, there is some true that you are what you eat, there is no correlation that eating a bird will enable you to fly like a bird, or that eating a fish will help you swim like a fish.
Jie ZHANG: @Kay Benedict：Yes. But astrology is a subject which is much much older than science, in China there is traditional Chinese medicine which also integrated human’s wisdom and experience. Science tries to prove what it eventually finds out and seemed have a history of only hundreds of years…science also tries to predict and or forecast but what science can do is still very limited as well.
Max Triatoris: We dont know NOTHING about world around us. Modern western material science is failed. Humans must find alternative way urgently or religions will capturing mind of future generation.
Naela Blosh: Nope.. No person with a scientific world view can accept astrology. The reason many people do believe clearly implies that scientific ignorance is widespread. It has neither rational nor empirical justification. Astrology has won the test of time because human stupidity is eternal.
Also there are too many logical loopholes in it for it to even be entertaining. I throw it in the same general category as tarot cards, palm reading, head bump readings, tea leaf readings, babas and godmen, crystal balls, superstitions, psychics, and other ways that people use to delude themselves that their destiny is somehow controlled by factors that are beyond their comprehension.
Emilijan Iljoski: Astrology, the science of the stars, is studying the movement of the sun and some planets and satellites and their effect on human behavior. In the studies are barely included a few celestial objects among billions of known stars on the sky, so why precisely those astral objects should make an impact on our behavior? A complete nonsense and absolutely nothing positive can be said to affirm the existence of this obscure science.
However, just a little bright affirmative note is that the unique left astrological product: the horoscope is made for entertainment and does its job quite well! Millions of people tend to read their horoscope on daily basis! It is quite amazing that the content what is written for one astrological sign may apply to all the other 11 ones! Try to read the horoscope integrally and you may realize that all 12 writings for the different signs may apply also to you!
At the other side, the crucial astrological product: the Almanac, a yearly overview of the past year and predictions for the coming year, a product that was the “main” book over centuries, totally lost its influence and some 50 years or more nobody reads it! Many do not even recall its existence at all! I just recall that the Almanac was somehow popular between the two World Wars in Europe and I keep in my family library several Almanacs from my grand-grand mother from the early 30’s of the 20th century. In these books, among the historical overview of the past year and the prediction of the next, they were explained different techniques for reading Tarot (and other) cards, predicting destiny in sculls, bones, rocks, beans, coffee and other techniques to sell “snake oil” and obscure fraudulent activities!
David Meiklejohn: It seems that many people believe in astrology, but I have no idea why. I agree with Naela – I see no reason to believe that astrology is valid.
There seems to be some confusion about what science is. Science is not about collecting data. Science is a process, by which people put forward an idea, based on data, test their idea, and if it seems true they publish their results for others to criticize and independently confirm. By this process, we gradually get closer to the truth, a better model of reality. Sometimes accepted theories are shot down, and that’s great – it’s the process by which we move forward.
No scientist believes they have all the answers. But science’s claims are testable, and based on documented evidence, and only “accepted” after much vigorous discussion.
That’s how it differs from astrology.
Calvin Lee: We all know the sun affects human beings and the moon has effects on tides, females, and maybe males (full moon turns them into color/werewolves). Some of the stars are much bigger but farther away than the sun & moon. they might still affect people, probably not by gravity/heat, possibly by some unknown undiscovered force – who knows 🙂
If people truly believe, it becomes true. the following is just an untrue example; don’t be offended – people believe children born in the year of dragon will be prosperous. So, the parents give them the best education and pressure them into studying hard and going to best colleges.
For now, just skeptical. best not to spend too much time or money on it.
Kurt Rihs: Astrology is just like any other religion. Like feng shui, it only affects and works for, or against the ones who belief in it. No religion is based on science or logic, not even scientology. But all religions have been used by minorities (priests, high-priests, leaders, etc.) to control most of humanity in one way or another. The Middle-east is an ongoing example of the gross miss-use or religion. Astrology has also played its part in some religious beliefs and practices of the past. I am with you Naela!
Naela Blosh: Here we go again…I say i do not believe in astrology. We have too much free will as humans to believe that the stars can tell us what path we will end up on in our future. It’s cool to think about, but not something that we should take seriously.. We are smarter than that. We decide what happens to us.
Ancient myth perhaps. Thank you!
Jie ZHANG: Naela, When you are over 40, you will know something called destiny or you might feel that being having no alternative on career, relationship etc…
Max Triatoris: Agree, Zhang. Naela so young and to belive in free will yet))).
John Kenmuir: Perhaps the reason there is no proof for or against astrology is because no one has bothered to study it (for fear of being typecast, perhaps?). Anyone who has ever been a bartender can tell you that on nights when there is a full moon, you can expect to have customers acting much more aggressively (trust me, this is more than just a myth).
I don’t believe that astrology can predict events, but I think it has a high level of accuracy when it is used to describe (or anticipate) people’s personalities and behaviours. By extension, we could argue that events could be predicted in relation to the personalities of the key players, but there are too many tangibles and variables to take into account if we were to try and make a prediction.
What many people who don’t know anything about astrology don’t understand is that it is, in its own way, a very complex procedure. Simply knowing one’s date of birth (and even the time of the birth) or their sun sign (major sign) isn’t enough. To properly understand its influence, an astrologer must consider the day and time of birth, and the position of the planets in relation to the person’s main planet (their sun sign). They must also take into account where a person was born, since this would affect the influence of the planets on them (due to their proximity and direction).
Until science considers astrology more seriously and makes an actual effort to study and interpret it, we will never know and the debate between astrology as science or superstition will rage on. But I would like to challenge the nay-sayers in the following manner: if you still refuse to believe in astrology, I would suggest that you make an honest attempt to study people’s faces. Yes, that’s right, their facial structures. If you do this and keep an open mind, you might notice something that is true more often than not (not full proof, but true in a general sense). You will notice that people born under the sign of Aries generally have very strong eyebrow muscles and strong, well defined noses (thin and linear), and that the eyebrow muscles almost seen to continue on into the nose bridge (there is no gap between them). Now go and look at the astrological sign for Aries, and compare the sign to the typical Aries’ facial structure. Notice any similarities?
John Kenmuir: That is very interesting, I had never even thought about applying astrology to cats and dogs, but it does make sense.
You are also correct about astrology not being able to develop weapons (although this is a good thing, I think) in the conventional sense; however, if you consider psychological warfare as a potential weapon (eg. manipulating soldiers’ behavior), I think that astrology could be just as open to abuse and misuse as any currently accepted field of science and study. For example, if you could predict how a person would behave under certain conditions, and then re-create those conditions, wouldn’t it be logical to assume that the person might probably react as predicted? This is, of course, not an absolute but it could be considered a probable result.
Max Triatoris: Look. We have 12 “moon” types and 12 “year cycles” types. Also existing 4 temperament types. Means totally on the Earth existing 12x12x4=574 types of peoples.
Its a enough for separated peoples according professional conditions: perfect engineers, perfect sales, perfect managers, perfect judge etc …and perfect soldiers, of course.
Jie ZHANG: There must be old sayings similar in your cultures.
谋事在人，成事在天。
Man proposes,God disposes.
Man do what he can,and god what he will.
God give the milk,but not the pail.
Max Triatoris: Russians said: Do you want God laugh, tell him about your plans)))
Jie ZHANG: From Wikipedia:
astrological beliefs in correspondences between celestial observations and terrestrial events have influenced various aspects of human history, including world-views, language and many elements of social culture.
Among Indo-European peoples, astrology has been dated to the 3rd millennium BC, with roots in calendrical systems used to predict seasonal shifts and to interpret celestial cycles as signs of divine communications.[1] Until the 17th century, astrology was considered a scholarly tradition, and it helped drive the development of astronomy. It was commonly accepted in political and cultural circles, and some of its concepts were used in other traditional studies, such as alchemy, meteorology and medicine.[2] By the end of the 17th century, emerging scientific concepts in astronomy, such as heliocentrism, were irrevocably undermining the theoretical basis of astrology, which subsequently lost its academic standing.
In the 20th century astrology gained broader consumer popularity through the influence of regular mass media products, such as newspaper horoscopes.[3]
Astrology, in its broadest sense, is the search for human meaning in the sky. It has been argued that astrology began as a study as soon as human beings made conscious attempts to measure, record, and predict seasonal changes by reference to astronomical cycles.[4]
Early evidence of such practices appears as markings on bones and cave walls, which show that lunar cycles were being noted as early as 25,000 years ago; the first step towards recording the Moon’s influence upon tides and rivers, and towards organizing a communal calendar.[5] With the Neolithic agricultural revolution new needs were also met by increasing knowledge of constellations, whose appearances in the night-time sky change with the seasons, allowing the rising of particular star-groups to herald annual floods or seasonal activities.[6] By the 3rd millennium BC, widespread civilizations had developed sophisticated awareness of celestial cycles, and are believed to have consciously oriented their temples to create alignment with the heliacal risings of the stars.[7]
There is scattered evidence to suggest that the oldest known astrological references are copies of texts made during this period. Two, from the Venus tablet of Ammisaduqa (compiled in Babylon round 1700 BC) are reported to have been made during the reign of king Sargon of Akkad (2334-2279 BC).[8] Another, showing an early use of electional astrology, is ascribed to the reign of the Sumerian ruler Gudea of Lagash (c. 2144 – 2124 BC). This describes how the gods revealed to him in a dream the constellations that would be most favourable for the planned construction of a temple.[9] However, controversy attends the question of whether they were genuinely recorded at the time or merely ascribed to ancient rulers by posterity. The oldest undisputed evidence of the use of astrology as an integrated system of knowledge is therefore attributed to the records that emerge from the Neo-Sumerian period (1950-1651 BC[clarification needed]).[citation needed]
Emilijan Iljoski: No Jie!
Astrology is quite the opposite of a science! It is a belief… Who believes, believes! If you know – you do not believe, you just know! And science is knowledge, thus it is not a belief like Astrology is!
By the way, the science that studies the “astres” (stars) is named astronomy! Not Astrology! In matter of facts, Astrology doesn’t study the effects of the stars on human being, as it is supposed to do, but it rather gives some odd remarks on surrounding planets (and satellites) on human behavior! Thus, from “Astro” not even the “A” left!
The relation Astrology – Astronomy is quite similar to the relation Alchemy – Chemistry!
Calvin Lee: Alchemy is kinda science. by changing # protons, scientists can turn 1 element into another.
anyway, real or not doesn’t matter. the question everyone should ask is, ‘is it making you a better person?’ if it is, you should believe, even if nobody else does. if not, you shouldn’t, even under a lot of pressure, even if it’s very real.
everyone knows superman is fictional. yet, we watch his movies, want to believe he is real, to be like him, saving the world and seeing the goodness in humanity.
on the other hand, during WWII, the Japanese soldiers shouldn’t have believed in their real imperial emperor so much.
and, of course, no one should believe this crap: 72 virgins after death for doing what the preacher wants.
Emilijan Iljoski: Calvin,
Changing # protons is not named Alchemy, but rather Nuclear Physics! Science is by definition something that can easily be experimentally proved in opposition to “snake oil” philosophies like Astrology or Alchemy where literally nothing cannot be experimentally proved!
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